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Being a good friend: Where's the line?

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17
Created
29.07.2015
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BambiDoll
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BambiDoll
This is an issue that's been bothering me an awful lot lately, and I wondered if any Bimbos had some thoughts or experiences with it.

Have you ever been in a situation where a friend has actively done something to affect your life ("for your own good, because I care about you") where you felt that they may have crossed the line and hurt your feelings in the process?

Maybe they disapproved of a lover and tried to drive that person away because they didn't feel he/she was right for you? This happened to me a couple of months ago when some friends who hadn't known me for a particularly long time felt that my guy was giving them attitude (he was tired, grouchy and they were very rude towards him). They asked him to leave our flat, and he did, since he felt so awkward being around these people and didn't want to cause trouble for me. These friends later tried to claim they were doing me a huge favour(??) I tried to confront the girls who did this about what happened, and told them it wasn't really their place to judge who I choose to date (particularly not to his face) and that I should be free to make my own mind up/learn from any of my mistakes. That's just life, right?

Today was a bad day. My "best friends" from my hometown staged something of an intervention, in which they detailed their issues with my "recent behaviour" and explained why they'd gone ahead and booked our summer city break without me. They felt that - due to my struggle with depression - it would be much more beneficial for everyone involved to just no longer include me in a holiday I'd actually suggested in the first place. I'm absolutely heartbroken and totally confused by all of the things they've said:

"I'm sorry, but I really just wanted this to be a drama free break"
"Besides can you even afford to come on holiday? I don't think it's wise in your current... situation"
"This is difficult to say but you need to try harder. Stop pinning your problems on your dad, ex boyfriend and friends."
"Obviously I would be sad if my Grandad died too, but you can't keep using that as an excuse"
"We still love you and are always here for you - we just need to think about our feelings too"

...what the fuck? Am I going insane or is this completely crossing the line in terms of caring for a friend?

29.07.2015 01:59:06
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Remi
That isn't 'caring' that's straight up not giving a shit about you, how you feel and pretty much everything someone who isn't your friend would do. You're definitely not at fault here. Literally they don't seem to care at all. You need to try and find some new friends and drop them because they really wont be good for your mental health. They didn't just cross a line that's literally "You're problems are such an inconvenience to ME so I'm just dumping you to deal with it yourself and going to have fun without you while trying to pretend that I'm doing this for your sake." Thats really unhealthy and abusive behaviour and you really don't deserve that.
29.07.2015 02:16:38
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HeavenLeighBimbo
BambiDoll wrote:

Have you ever been in a situation where a friend has actively done something to affect your life ("for your own good, because I care about you") where you felt that they may have crossed the line and hurt your feelings in the process?

Maybe they disapproved of a lover and tried to drive that person away because they didn't feel he/she was right for you? This happened to me a couple of months ago when some friends who hadn't known me for a particularly long time felt that my guy was giving them attitude (he was tired, grouchy and they were very rude towards him). They asked him to leave our flat, and he did, since he felt so awkward being around these people and didn't want to cause trouble for me. These friends later tried to claim they were doing me a huge favour(??) I tried to confront the girls who did this about what happened, and told them it wasn't really their place to judge who I choose to date (particularly not to his face) and that I should be free to make my own mind up/learn from any of my mistakes. That's just life, right?
___
 Am I going insane or is this completely crossing the line in terms of caring for a friend?

Yes,  I've been in this situation.  I was in the situation of "being the friend", causing the trouble, however.  It was a very unique situation however, because I was a bit more tactful in dealing with the situation of trying to help my friend.  I didn't like being placed in the middle of the affairs of the heart. Yet because of the large age difference between me and my friend, I felt I had to use some of my experience in reading men to help her, with what I would call, one-X-one talks with her. I did everything in my power to warn her about this man.  I knew things about him from other sources. Nothing I would say to her mattered, to her undeveloped emotional pubescent  mind.  My efforts were ultimately unsuccessful because someone who thinks they are in love, will always chose a lover over a friend every time no matter what age they are.

 The result of my failure was drastic for my friend.  A pregnant 12 year old girl.  Should I taken more drastic steps to break her up from the 19 year old man who got her pregnant?  I wasn't sure I could have broken up the two lovers even if I got into the mans face.  The man in question was her brothers best friend and I eventually discovered was the family drug dealer.
 The end result was just a very sad and pathetic,"I told you so moment."  Her parents didn't even report this, as should have been their parental duty.
She didn't listen to me, because she still would see the man every day at home. Her curiosity about sex won her a child at the age of 13 years and 3 months. 
 Did I hurt her in this situation?
   Maybe yes maybe NO.
  We are still best friends, but it hurts me to see her struggle with abject poverty now at the age of 21 and now 3 small children, and still her parents are in jail anyways on unrelated issues, and she is alone anyhow.  I advised her again at 15 when she first met a second adult man. Still she got pregnant again at 15, and again at 17 by a 3rd man.  I could have stopped her,the first time with a single phone call to the authorities.  Yet how would she have felt about me, to see her whole family thrown in jail, for the next 20 years of her childhood because of a single phone call I 'could have' made?
   I had to make a judgement call, and let her make her own choices in HER life.  and just picked up the pieces of her shattered heart later.  That's what friends do.  In a way I sort of regret that choice now seeing what she is dealing with now in life.  I didn't even want to be her friend in the first place, but I saved her life from a drowning accident when she was 11 years old and from that time on, she always made it a point to call me everyday from that time forward.  I became her adopted mother and best friend.  I did the best I could to save her life, but ultimately everyone has to decide how to live all by themselves.  She was hiding so many facts about her home life, even from me.  I didn't know many of the facts of this story till after the worst had already happened to her.  Yet because I just stayed her friend the future for her is still un-written and she has the time to learn from her past mistakes to make a better future for herself and her children.  I can also still be there to give her advice like a mother should be doing for her.  It was just meant to be this way for reasons even I can't understand. I was there at the right time and the right place for her, many times and that can't be just a coincidence.

  I'm just saying that sometimes a friend may know things that they can't always say directly to you face, in plain language.  I couldn't exactly tell her that she was being raped.  She was under the impression that they loved her, and as soon as a pregnancy resulted they all ran away as far as they could. Also ironically to jail, also on un-related charges. (drugs, which also was her parents crime. Karma?) She lost her parents anyways at age 18, and fell through the cracks of social services because she was now considered an adult with health problems due to early childhood pregnancy issues.  She will forever be on welfare and likely to die at a very early age because she never learned how to respect her body.  This paragraph is something I wish I could tell her right now,  but I don't.  What good would it do to hurt her more than her own family has.
  Should I have let her drowned or was it best to give her a second chance at LIFE?
 I just didn't have the power to change her future life, because I was only her friend and she was to young to understand the advice I was trying to give her.  How could she understand the situation she was about to place herself into, when she thought a man welcomed into her home by her parents, loved her too.

  This is very painful for me to think about too. PTSD, happens to me because of the line of work I did during that time.
  I still just see her as a little girl in the water about to die.
I did the only thing I could do at the moment. I judge myself very harshly for not doing more for that child.

  This is just my example of why I will say this:
   I just think you need to sit down with your friend and ask her what she knows about this boyfriend of yours that has her so upset with him.  If she can't tell you, than she just might be the one making the mistake.  There must be more to her attitude towards him than just meets the eye during a party at the flat.

BambiDoll wrote:  the things they've said
"I'm sorry, but I really just wanted this to be a drama free break"
"Besides can you even afford to come on holiday? I don't think it's wise in your current... situation"
"This is difficult to say but you need to try harder. Stop pinning your problems on your dad, ex boyfriend and friends."
"Obviously I would be sad if my Grandad died too, but you can't keep using that as an excuse"
"We still love you and are always here for you - we just need to think about our feelings too"

There is something to these statements that tells me that they are trying to avoid saying something to you.  An intervention, or a way of distancing themselves from a perceived problem with the holiday plans? 

 
I got a bad 'vibe' , when I read those comments they said to you. In any case I don't think they are speaking the whole truth about the nature of the emotions of all parties and the relationships with one another.

  No, your not insane.
You asked the question, so I sense that your using some female intuition too.




29.07.2015 03:04:05
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Ceres
I agree with Remi. Bambi if they were truly your best friends they would know that the best thing you needed was that vacation break to ease your mind and get you happy as best as they could. I do believe that you too need a break of your own. You need the relaxation and fun. to some extent I have to say that yes the passing of a loved one can hurt you dearly especially if they were close to you. But I also think that the burden of their death on you and the grief you have in your heart for them will continue to bring you down and then you won't see the ends of your depression. You have to now accept the fact that it has happened and you have to let that grief go away. You have to let it go. I'm a bit superstitious so i'll tell you in my country holding onto a grief for so long to weigh you down does not make the spirit of the deceased move on. They will not sleep in peace. I'm not assuming this is what happens to. I'm just relating. I honestly believe in afterlife maybe you don't but you will see your loved ones later. You're not forgetting them when you let go of your grief. Their love and your love for them will always remain. 
29.07.2015 11:05:35
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Mandi
I agree with Remi too, friends don't exclude each other, especially when one is having a hard time. I think a lot of people don't understand depression, and it seems like that's part of the problem with your friends. that comment about how you should 'try harder' actually angers me a little. it's so insulting to tell someone who's dealing with an illness, and grief, to just 'try harder'. it's basically telling them its their fault, when really anyone can become depressed, and that's not their fault. Anyways, I really hope your friends start treating you better.
29.07.2015 18:05:23
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Remi
Trust me when i say you deserve better and none of whats happened is your fault. I know how easy it is to blame yourself when people are trying to make you think its your fault, but it really isnt.This is definitely not a you problem.
29.07.2015 21:19:02
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BambiDoll
Remi wrote:
That isn't 'caring' that's straight up not giving a shit about you, how you feel and pretty much everything someone who isn't your friend would do. You're definitely not at fault here. Literally they don't seem to care at all. You need to try and find some new friends and drop them because they really wont be good for your mental health. They didn't just cross a line that's literally "You're problems are such an inconvenience to ME so I'm just dumping you to deal with it yourself and going to have fun without you while trying to pretend that I'm doing this for your sake." Thats really unhealthy and abusive behaviour and you really don't deserve that.
I was initially in floods of tears, but since talking to some of my other friends I've realised how laughable and ridiculous they are for they way they've orchestrated this whole situation. It's absolutely pathetic to think that these 23 year olds, feeling so self-important with their very first 9 to 5 office jobs, sat down together and actually figured out the best way to break it to me like a pair of bitchy schoolgirls. They've told me to grow up and get a grip before (eg, I don't drive because my abusive ex-boyfriend made me quit, and I've since had major anxiety about picking it back up again) but at least I'm not playing at being an adult in the way they are. It's just so fake.

Ok - What have I got to lose if I ditch these people? Probably the most consistent part of my social life, since I see these girls on a regular basis at least once week. It's usually a catch up over a meal or drinks out where they discuss nothing but their jobs and make me feel excluded - The only time it's good is when the boys we're friends with join us, because they don't just want to talk about work - They make me laugh. I'm just scared of one girl in particular telling them a twisted version of the story, cause I don't want to be blacklisted by the entire group just because of how one person manipulates it. I do have other friends that live further away, unfortunately. One of them I won't be able to meet up with for another 3 weeks because it's a £40 train fare to visit him and he's waiting to get paid, so he can actually afford to take me out places while I'm there.


HeavenLeighBimbo wrote:
This is just my example of why I will say this:
   I just think you need to sit down with your friend and ask her what she knows about this boyfriend of yours that has her so upset with him.  If she can't tell you, than she just might be the one making the mistake.  There must be more to her attitude towards him than just meets the eye during a party at the flat.

She'd actually never met him before, no one had. It was totally weird. The only information they had on him was what I'd already told them before that night at the flat. Upon meeting him, they were actually very quick to point out and question him about what his race and accent were, which is pretty rude and obnoxious in my opinion. She's a very hot headed, quick tempered girl so I think she was the one making a mistake. I think when you have a reason to intervene where you're actually protecting someone from harm, that's totally different. If the "harm" you see is that you simply don't like the look of a person and think your friend could do better, it's genuinely interfering in ways that cross a line (or so I think). I'm just annoyed that she felt it was her place to do that. My good friend and wingwoman (you might have heard about her in my stories in The Founders Inn thread) sometimes dates guys that I don't think are all that. She has a totally different "type" to me though. She wants a suave, smartly dressed man who can take her out to nice places. She's currently seeing one who has a bit of an issue with cocaine, which she doesn't really approve of. We talk about it since I kind of know what it's like (my guy has had to overcome drug problems from his past, which came back to haunt him - He's ok now) but it's ultimately up to her to decide whether to date him. If I think she was getting into hard drugs because of a guy, that would be another story entirely. Thing is she isn't and would never - We're both sensible girls. I can't count the number of times we've gone out together, been chatted up by men who ultimately invited us to snort lines of coke/mdma/whatever with them, to which we will ALWAYS politely reject.


Ceres wrote:

I agree with Remi. Bambi if they were truly your best friends they would know that the best thing you needed was that vacation break to ease your mind and get you happy as best as they could. I do believe that you too need a break of your own. You need the relaxation and fun. to some extent I have to say that yes the passing of a loved one can hurt you dearly especially if they were close to you. But I also think that the burden of their death on you and the grief you have in your heart for them will continue to bring you down and then you won't see the ends of your depression. You have to now accept the fact that it has happened and you have to let that grief go away. You have to let it go. I'm a bit superstitious so i'll tell you in my country holding onto a grief for so long to weigh you down does not make the spirit of the deceased move on. They will not sleep in peace. I'm not assuming this is what happens to. I'm just relating. I honestly believe in afterlife maybe you don't but you will see your loved ones later. You're not forgetting them when you let go of your grief. Their love and your love for them will always remain. 

I think that was the thing that really confused me about it. There's no way they could understand what I'm going through if they genuinely felt I wouldn't have benefitted from that city break. They seem to believe they're doing me a favour here, and it's just bullshit. As for the death thing, I think the reason I'm still grieving is because the funeral isn't until next Monday. It will feel a lot more final, and there should be some closure for my family after that. Thank you for sharing your kind words and experiences, it means a lot 



Mandi wrote:
I agree with Remi too, friends don't exclude each other, especially when one is having a hard time. I think a lot of people don't understand depression, and it seems like that's part of the problem with your friends. that comment about how you should 'try harder' actually angers me a little. it's so insulting to tell someone who's dealing with an illness, and grief, to just 'try harder'. it's basically telling them its their fault, when really anyone can become depressed, and that's not their fault. Anyways, I really hope your friends start treating you better. 

It's funny because one of the friends who I've spoken to a lot recently (he knows all this has happened too) doesn't really understand depression at all, yet has a lot of patience and positive words for me. He's an incredible listener, trying his best to learn/understand what I'm going through, and anything he suggests is genuinely kind - Not like he thinks he can try to save me. Whereas one of the "friends" who was involved in the whole intervention has actually had depression herself, when she was a teenager. She made a rude comment about me acting like an 18 year old, because that's the age she was when she was going through it. I think seeing me suffering must remind her of that former self she's left behind or something? She was also the one who told me I needed to suck it up and try harder, whilst detailing the steps she took to get to where she is now almost as a guide for me to follow. I thought someone else who had suffered would have realised how personal and different it can be for everyone.
30.07.2015 01:58:29
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Mandi
BambiDoll wrote:



Mandi wrote:
I agree with Remi too, friends don't exclude each other, especially when one is having a hard time. I think a lot of people don't understand depression, and it seems like that's part of the problem with your friends. that comment about how you should 'try harder' actually angers me a little. it's so insulting to tell someone who's dealing with an illness, and grief, to just 'try harder'. it's basically telling them its their fault, when really anyone can become depressed, and that's not their fault. Anyways, I really hope your friends start treating you better. 

It's funny because one of the friends who I've spoken to a lot recently (he knows all this has happened too) doesn't really understand depression at all, yet has a lot of patience and positive words for me. He's an incredible listener, trying his best to learn/understand what I'm going through, and anything he suggests is genuinely kind - Not like he thinks he can try to save me. Whereas one of the "friends" who was involved in the whole intervention has actually had depression herself, when she was a teenager. She made a rude comment about me acting like an 18 year old, because that's the age she was when she was going through it. I think seeing me suffering must remind her of that former self she's left behind or something? She was also the one who told me I needed to suck it up and try harder, whilst detailing the steps she took to get to where she is now almost as a guide for me to follow. I thought someone else who had suffered would have realised how personal and different it can be for everyone.
youre right, it really is a personal thing. one person's solution is not a guaranteed solution for someone else. maybe your friend who had it is ashamed of it? so she let that shame out on you? this is just me theorizing from an outsiders perspective though. im glad you have a friend who is a good listener :) from my experience with depression i find it helps a lot to just be able to talk to someone who cares.
30.07.2015 02:25:34
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BambiDoll
Mandi wrote:
BambiDoll wrote:



Mandi wrote:
I agree with Remi too, friends don't exclude each other, especially when one is having a hard time. I think a lot of people don't understand depression, and it seems like that's part of the problem with your friends. that comment about how you should 'try harder' actually angers me a little. it's so insulting to tell someone who's dealing with an illness, and grief, to just 'try harder'. it's basically telling them its their fault, when really anyone can become depressed, and that's not their fault. Anyways, I really hope your friends start treating you better. 

It's funny because one of the friends who I've spoken to a lot recently (he knows all this has happened too) doesn't really understand depression at all, yet has a lot of patience and positive words for me. He's an incredible listener, trying his best to learn/understand what I'm going through, and anything he suggests is genuinely kind - Not like he thinks he can try to save me. Whereas one of the "friends" who was involved in the whole intervention has actually had depression herself, when she was a teenager. She made a rude comment about me acting like an 18 year old, because that's the age she was when she was going through it. I think seeing me suffering must remind her of that former self she's left behind or something? She was also the one who told me I needed to suck it up and try harder, whilst detailing the steps she took to get to where she is now almost as a guide for me to follow. I thought someone else who had suffered would have realised how personal and different it can be for everyone.
youre right, it really is a personal thing. one person's solution is not a guaranteed solution for someone else. maybe your friend who had it is ashamed of it? so she let that shame out on you? this is just me theorizing from an outsiders perspective though. im glad you have a friend who is a good listener :) from my experience with depression i find it helps a lot to just be able to talk to someone who cares.
He's a very happy, genuine person and always willing to do something to cheer me up. He's suggested we go swimming together some time as something to do, and I think it's a great idea since exercise can really help with depression - Which he had no idea about. He actually just really likes doing sports and stuff, which is probably how he maintains this wonderfully happy-go-lucky attitude to life.
30.07.2015 03:11:36
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Roman
To put it simply, in this time of your life, you need to find people who have your best interest at heart. Who know how to be there for you, love you, and communicate with you. We hold on so tightly to other people as humans because it's in our nature to do so, but personally, I'd sooner be alone, with myself, someone I know for a fact LOVES me, than with a bunch of people for the sake of a friendship title. That word gets thrown around too loosely these days. So let go, work on yourself, and the right people will find you, I speak from experience. You don't need that kind of negativity in your life.
30.07.2015 17:54:36
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The Bimbo Dollar (B$). Currently it is pegged in value to the US$

Who is the President of Bimbo land?
Miss Bimbo is the president of Bimbo land. She founded the bimbo nation in 2007 after escaping the tyranny, bigotry and and conservatism of the old world. You can read more about her here and here

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